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1
Anonymous
07 Jun 2012 7:41PM

WOW there is SO MUCH IGNORANCE in this thread!!! Let Me Explain A Few Things To ALL of you:

-ISM = thinking feeling believing or acting based on whatever comes before the ISM.

PERIOD. So YES, if you say MOST of this race or THIS race does THAT more, it doesn't matter that you don't mean ALL of them, it doesn't matter if you don't INTEND to sound racist, it doesn't matter if you SAY that YOU are not racist. Someone mentioned the difference between racism and bigotry earlier. One problem is that the term RACIST has been used when you're really talking about bigotry. While Racism is as wrong as almost all other ISMs, it is not itself about HATE, but only IGNORANCE. A Bigot is a person who embraces, lives, even loves their racist beliefs.

To make a generalization about a group of people based on their age is to make an ageist generalization. To promote sexist stereotypes is to make comments about people based on their gender.

IF YOU ARE USING RACE IN YOUR STATEMENT, IT IS BY DEFINITION RACIST.

You CANNOT say, "I'm not racist, it's just my personal observations that Whites are the most racist people." You CAN'T SAY THAT. WHY? Because you are making a generalization about WHITES. It doesn't matter if you're not saying all whites are racist. What matters is that you are using a LABEL and attributing characteristics to people under that LABEL. Most of the people that I have seen expressing racist stereotypes were black, do I say blacks are the most racist race? NO, because I am not IGNORANT enough to believe like SO MANY DO, that the color of their skin is even RELEVANT to ANYTHING. We are all INDIVIDUAL HUMAN BEINGS. You cannot MAKE generalizations or stereotypes about large groups of us and expect them to make ANY sense, because NO MATTER how many individuals happen to conform to that stereotype, there will ALWAYS be enough who DON't to render the statement USELESS. Walk up to a random black person, white person, asian person, old person, gay person, whatever. Make a list of assumptions about that person based on stereotypes. What's the likelihood that that list is going to be 100% right. 50%? 10%?

The fact of the matter is that ISMS are NOT useful or reliable ways to LABEL people, they are detrimental to our coming together as we really should be able to, as the only race there is: The Human Race. Until we stop THINKing of black people as black people, white people as white people, asian women as lousy drivers, we will NEVER outgrow these STUPID racial divisions.

The past is what it is. There are things that have happened that should never have happened. They cannot be changed now. What can be changed now are our perceptions and attitudes toward our fellow HUMAN BEINGS, each of whom is as unique an individual as YOU are. With feelings that are as valid as yours are.

The people who like to say "oh, well there's blacks and there's N-words, and theres whites and theres white trash and theres blah blah asians hispanics etc." Are NOT helping things. IT's still JUST as racist and bigoted, it's just another way of saying "OH, my bigotry doesn't extend to ALL members of your race, so if it doesn't apply to you you can't be offended," The offensive words you use to refer to the individuals you don't like are offensive. EVERYONE should be offended to hear one person call another a "Spic." The N word has never left my mouth, nor my fingertips, nor will it. The fact that you can list off a bunch of them based on RACE shows that they ARE STILL RACIST.

ACCEPT that we are all unique individual HUMAN BEINGS.

There ARE no spics, chinks, white trash, N-words, whatever. Those are useless terms that keep us divided out of IGNORANCE. Ignorance and HATE are butt buddies. I can honestly say that I do not think of people based on irrelevant labels. It wasn't easy, it took time, our very SOCIETY programs us to categorize people by color or religion or whatever. Our BRAIN works by learning what to generalize and what to discriminate. You have to take an active role in changing how you think about people. I seriously do not think or talk about people's race AT ALL anymore. It is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT to ANY intelligent thing you can think say or do. The only thing I can say about a black man is that he is black and male. THAT's it. Even then, his skin is rarely going to be "black" per se, there are a huge variety of shades of skin, most of them variants on brown. The only thing I can say about a "white woman" is that she is female. I can't even say she's white, because unless she's a full on albino, she ain't white.

THERE is NOTHING you can SAY THINK or DO to or about ANYone that will benefit in any meaningful way from including irrelevant demographic data such as race, age, etc. NOTHING. You say something about black people, you're WRONG, you say something about white people, you're WRONG. THAT simple. We can move beyond that foolish shit now. We don't need the "shortcut" to actually thinking about that person as a PERSON. We don't need to make guesses or assumptions about them. We need to view each and every human being we encounter as an individual worthy of love and respect. Because we all are. I love and respect you. But I will respect you a hell of a lot more if you all drop the ignorant race crap, K? THX

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Anonymous
07 Jun 2012 7:57PM

The only post you should read on this page really

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SopwithHell
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08 Jun 2012 12:44AM

Seconded

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Anonymous
08 Jun 2012 1:44AM

"Monster Poster" again.

I understand what you're saying about people being individuals, reguardless of race. I understand that, believe it, and factor it in to everything. I'm also a huge advocate for taking things on an individual basis, and I do agree with "we need to view each and every human being we encounter as an individual worthy of love and respect, because we all are". That's a completely true statement, and I try my best to do just that.

I'll get into that more towards the end of this post so it's best to read through it all. The following is an explanation of why profiling and stereotyping are not ignorant, and then after that I ask the hard question, which is "Are you really prepared to look at ALL stereotypes and break things down to an individual basis in order to make the planet and our experience here better? Are you prepared to better understand and individualize Nazis? Terrorists? Animal Abusers? Those who you'd call child Molesters? Or is it simply ok to stuff each and every one of them into a stereotyped box because it serves your current feelings, all instead of looking at them individually, and as individuals worthy of love and respect?

I'm not sure most people are prepared to do that, even though they say they want no stereotypes and want to individualize for the sake of understanding/peace/love (which I think is a great thing to strive for. Can you do it though?)


Back to my explanation though, profiling and stereotyping are not ignorant. The opposite, actually. Ignoring actions and facts BASED on the color of someone's skin, IS ignorant, even in the literal sense of the word. To be ignorant is to IGNORE something. IGNORE-ant. If you ignore the actions and behaviors of a said group overall, simply because it makes you uncomfortable to talk about or because you may be wrong in a particular case, THAT's ignorant - even literally. The people who point things out and put a spotlight on them and look at them as they are, are the furthest thing FROM ignorant! They're OBSERVant actually!

To be honest, I think the best thing you could do to help cure black/white racism, is take 15 of the most racist blacks and whites you can possibly find in the country, put them in a room separated with bullet proof glass where they can hear each other, and keep them in there for 2 weeks. By the end of it, they'll wind up discussing the reasons behind why they hate each other so much and get to the bottom of everything and come out with more understanding, which will usually always solve a problem. Yeah the first week will be them pounding on the glass and cussing each other out, but that'll get old after so many hours. I think ignoring the problems and mindsets and trying to just put a smile on and "drop it" is actually ignorant, and what helps keep the problem alive. Realistically how often do people openly discuss their racisms in public? Almost never, yet look at how much supposed racism there is. Isn't that kind of a curious point? Yeah I've heard stuff more than quite a few times, but of course not on a daily basis or anything.

Again, being IGNORant, is to ignore something. So actually, NOT taking note of things going on around you and naturally stereotyping or profiling, is very ignorant in the very nature and truest sense of the word. For a more innocent example (and again it's an exaggurated example to make a point), let's say the last 785 times out of 1000 that I witnessed someone smoking Newports, they were black. I would not be IGNORant at all if I made the proclamation "Most black smokers smoke Newports", I would actually be the opposite - very OBSERVant as opposed to IGNORant! Reason being, in this example, my personal experience would have been true. It would be VERY ignorant of someone to IGNORE that 785 out of 1000 blacks smokers smoked Newports, simply to avoid being called ignorant, racist, bigot, etc, especially when those words makes no sense there because they are LITERALLY the OPPOSITE of what's actually taking place during the profiling! So yes, there ARE whites and white trash, blacks and nigs, etc. To not recognize that, IS being ignorant! Well, ok you're right actually, I see what you're saying in the sense that no, technically they aren't; those are catagories that we created, and then stuffed people into. What I'm saying though, is that there was nothing IGNORant about that process. Quite the opposite, they were created out of being OBSERVant, not IGNORant! Unfortunately sometimes people get put in the wrong basket, (alot of times through fault of their own) it's a servicable system because it's correct more often than it is incorrect. It's not a perfect system obviously and has it's flaws, but it's very functional.

Basically, if you had to place bets on things for real, you absolutely would bet on sterotypes; you'd be stupid not to! If you see a black guy in super baggy clothes hanging out on a street corner for 3 hours around 2am in a bad neighborhood, and you were forced to make a real bet, would you bet on him being a drug dealer, or a grocery store owner who just happens to be up late that night? Of course you'd put your money on drug dealer! Does that make you a racist, ignorant bigot? No, not at all, again quite the opposite. That makes you OBSERVant not IGNORant. You're drawing on your experiences and coming to the intelligent conclusion that he's more likely a drug dealer than a grocery store owner, because the last 100 times you encountered this situation, he was not a grocery store owner, but a decent number of those times was a drug dealer. That's OBSERVant, not IGNORant.

Now you might be wrong, that's very true. In this particular case, the guy you bet on might be a college graduate who just finished medical school and hasn't done or sold a drug in his life! But again, lets say you didn't lose any money on the bet if he was anything BUT a store owner or a dealer right.. If you were forced to make a bet on it 1000 times, you would bet on drug dealer before grocery store owner every time. Why? Because you know that in the longrun, if you had to make that bet 1000 times, you'd win a hell of alot more money betting on drug dealer, than grocery store owner. OBSERVant, not IGNORant.

Let's take a more uncomfortable, serious example. Everyone in this thread is a racist, ignorant biggot then if they say they hate Nazis. They were all individuals, yet I'm sure you all have no problem labeling each and every last one of them as innocent-Jew slaughtering hate-filled butchers and walking pieces of shit with 0 morals and no reguard for anything or anyone - every last one of them and all the millions of people that supported them. Every last individual; that's how strongly most people feel about it I'm sure.

So that raises the question - are you sure this is really what you want? I think most of you THINK you do, but when it comes to hard topics like this, I don't think you're ready or prepared to do it.

I'm all for it.

I agree with you, I think it would make our planet and our experience here a MUCH, MUCH better place if all this stereotyping and shit went away. It means a completely FUNDAMENTAL change in every aspect of how we look at EVERYTHING though, even the stuff we currently view as 'vile' and 'sick'.

Are you really prepared to back up your words and do that though? To look at things like Nazis, terrorists, those you'd call child molesters, animal abusers, etc? To try to understand where they're coming from and love them and treat them as individuals, and try to get to the core of the situations and try to find a better way? Would you be willing to give up the way you currently function, and give up alot of your morals and beliefs to come to a loving compromise that benefits all and not just you and your view?

Are you really? I don't think most of you are, even though you might think you are.

Just something to think about!

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